Polytunnel and Now a Greenhouse

[bazzaboy]

Thank you for these suggestions and look forward to the pics.... this is fast becoming THE 2012 project for me!

2S - thank you for the Hemenway book suggestion.... to judge by price of original publication clearly a collector's item now but they have republished it at standard price... I'll check with Library first but otherwise might invest as it's a neat "alternative" set of ideas in some contrast to the constant "new" allotment books that all seem to say the same thing... Also reminds me to check with my "Transition" connections as well as they are good at low-cost solutions. The "swale" (creating a boggy area) is an interesting idea, I did wonder if using the incline on the allotment if large sheets pinned down on the upside slope (if you see what I mean) could channel rainfall towards the polytunnel. From one extreme to the other, with all these solutions it'll be so wet I'll be growing rice.... anyone for a swim?

Alison - interested to see the photos... Last year using the incline (I'm obsessed with this incline... it's only a very gentle slope) I did put some seep pipe from a bucket but didn't think of a timed tap, very clever - with one of those the plants will be being watered while I'm playing with my plastic ducks or having a swim....

Mark - as yours was the original question hope some of this useful to you in your choice of tunnel.... I'd say both if pos.

No response from the polytunnel company as yet, patience is a virtue (but virtues not my strong point!)

[bazzaboy]

Just read the Tanzania article, 2S.... brilliant, thanks, if they can do that in a desert then north Notts should not be such a challenge! Am beset with different alternatives now... am at pen and paper planning stage.......fascinating.
Still no response from the polytunnel company.....

[Two_Sheds]

if they can do that in a desert then north Notts should not be such a challenge!

That's what I was thinking. The Gaia book has a great section about raised beds in Mexico (if I remember right)

[bazzaboy]

I'll try and take some piccies of the watering system this weekend if I can brave the cold

Alison, Weather not conducive to trips to the loti to take pix of your auto system but meantime a couple of questions/observations. I have tried using seep hose from a water butt in the garden but didn’t find it very successful because seep hose relies on a pressure more associated with mains tap than gravity feed (with the result it leaks from a few places only rather than along its length). Are you using special seep pipe that works at low pressure?

Recently I noticed in Dobbies and this evening also on the Two Wests and Elliott (2W&E) site a “water butt drip kit” that is basically hosepipe with holes in it so it will dribble at low pressure, see
Two Wests - Please enable your cookies

LOL... funny reference, but link seems to work..... Is that the one you're using, or similar?

So far no answers to my questions to the polytunnel company but I’ve looked extensively through books and internet for solutions to the collecting problem coz I realise I’m not asking the question for the first time! I remain a bit sceptical of some solutions that attach modifications by drilling holes through the fabric (I’d be scared of doing that, seems like asking for trouble… ). I need to look at a polytunnel when it’s raining… I imagine the rain runs in little rivulets down the curved roof and then down the wall (but some seem to have walls to give greater head height at edges which results in an angle rather than a continuous curve so that water would probably cascade off rather than run down the wall…). The simplest solution I’ve found so far (if it works and doesn’t compromise the fabric) is again available from 2W&E and is a small semi-rigid light plastic guttering that is simply stuck on the tunnel side at a shallow angle… brilliantly simple if it works but why don’t they all use it? Picture at:

Two Wests - Please enable your cookies

Any experience of that one?

One Polytunnel book also mentions something similar (may be the same product) produced by Northern Polytunnels – couldn’t see any details on their website but have sent an email requesting further details….

Final question Alison (for now at any rate) – would you say yours is the ideal size for having enough room for the usual range and a few trials and experiments (or maybe without any mains water would be better a bit smaller?)

Many thanks for any help…… bb.

[bazzaboy]

This book, Gaia's Garden, has some really inspirational stories about veg gardens in desert conditions, well worth a read (order from your library?)

The Gaia book has a great section about raised beds in Mexico

Notts Libraries don't seem to have it so have ordered the 2nd edition (cheapest) version... it looks really different to the regular Allotment and Tunnel books I've combed through today (which somehow seem to repeat the same stuff over and over again....) so looking forward to it. Chapter 5 seems to be the one!! And some progress made on guttering too (above) so inching nearer..... Many thanks.

[SarzWix]

First Tunnels and Northern Polytunnels both sell the stick on guttering, so it should be okay. I ordered some for the school P/T, only to be told that we couldn't have waterbutts next to it, so we haven't used it

[bazzaboy]

First Tunnels and Northern Polytunnels both sell the stick on guttering, so it should be okay. I ordered some for the school P/T, only to be told that we couldn't have waterbutts next to it, so we haven't used it

Thanks SarzWix... that's a shame, doesn't help to teach a green agenda does it? Mind you in a school it might be a bit too tempting as a hiding place/dare etc. Modern water butts are intended to be childproof (oh yeah? is anything?) and I have two which I think are almost human-proof or certainly bazzaboy-proof as I can't (couldn't) get the lids off at all!

[SarzWix]

We're allowed to have butts next to the school building, as long as they're chained to the wall, and locked shut, but next to the P/T it was felt there was too much risk of them being knocked into/knocked over. Fair enough I guess, the kids do play football nearby

[Two_Sheds]

Have you ever TRIED to knock or push over a full butt? I can't

[veggiechicken]

No risk to the polytunnel though with the football?

[Potstubsdustbins]

Must be very strong kids in your part of the world. 220ltrs=48.3gall=483Ilbs thats over 4 cwt. I am 16 stone and even I would stuggle to push that over.

Colin

[Alison]

First Tunnels and Northern Polytunnels both sell the stick on guttering, so it should be okay. I ordered some for the school P/T, only to be told that we couldn't have waterbutts next to it, so we haven't used it

Don't worry, they don't work anyway. I had them to start with and only managed to get a dribble of water to make it to the butts, they're far too narrow to really work well which is a shame.

[Alison]

Did get to the lottie today but I forgot to take my camera with me but will definitely do it next weekend

Re your questions, yes, just have normal soaker hose like this 25m Soaker Hose | Leaky Pipe Hose | Hozelock with sections of normal hose from the butts to the beds. I then also have normal hose making a ring main round the inside sides of the tunnel with plastic Ts putting the soaker hose into each bed. The soaker hose is buried but is supposed to run off low pressure. If you do it off the mains then you have to put a pressure reducer in anyway. I have no idea if the water flow is even but it is good enough. I did trial it with the soaker hose on the surface to start with and it definitely worked reasonably. I have since buried it down the centre of each beds.

As mentioned above, the stick on polythene gutters as shown on your link really don't work. I started off with that and only got a dribble into the butts, almost all the rain water just spilled over and onto the ground, the guttering is tiny and just not worth while. The guttering I use now is shed sized guttering and even then some water overtops it when it rains heavily. I too didn't want to pierce the plastic so support the guttering from wooden posts in the ground. The only thing that is connected to the tunnel fabric is offcuts more plastic sheet which I have taped to the side of the tunnel using that repair tape that you can buy.

I got the biggest tunnel which would fit on my site with all the other stuff I wanted to grow. Ideally I think it's worth going for the largest you can fit (without missing out on required outdoor space) and afford. I don't know if it's because I'm used to the size I have now but I think I'd feel restricted if it was any smaller.

[bazzaboy]

Alison, Many thanks for taking the time and trouble to give such full answers (and sorry I asked the same question twice, have just re-read your earlier posts.... my memory duh!). But what a shame that the stick-on guttering doesn't work, I had a feeling it was too good to be true.

Very interested some time to see a pic of how the poly-skirt idea works and the auto system, creative gardening!

Thanks again.... bb.

[bazzaboy]

hi Alison, am posting this as a note on site so info accessible to all.... I contacted various polytunnel companies, received brochures, asked about water collection etc and the "not recommended" small-scale stick-on guttering still seems to be the one most are using. However Haygrove (inevitably one of the more expensive polytunnel companies working in both the commercial/horticultural arena as well as supplying to the allotment/garden enthusiast) are developing a guttering system for their tunnels and I was invited to visit a wonderful new school in nearby Derbyshire to see a prototype. 3 photos below which show outside guttering, water collection and inside fixing of guttering. VERY firmly fixed guttering of standard size, usual array of butts, overflows etc. The Coordinator at the school, who took time out to show me around, confirmed it worked 100% and withstood storm and tempest on their windy site. Clearly quite an extensive modification (not just a "stuck on" but bolted to substantial metal strips both lengths of the polytunnel) so not likely to be cheap but by all accounts did the job. One for me to ponder.
bb.

ps still interested to see the Alison Variation if an opportunity arises.