Open / closed pollination

[Chippy Minton]

I could ask this question in a complex and high bro sounding way but what it boils down to is.... I grew Cobra climbing French beans, runner beans and bush type French beans in the same bed. If, as I understand it they're closed pollinators, when I dry the seed and sow next year will the beans come true or will I get some sort of weird runner climbing bush French bean hybrid?

[Bigmallly]

I believe that to be the case as closed pollinators are self fertile where as open pollinators rely on insects, wind, human intervention etc.

[Martin H]

The french beans should come true, the runner beans might not - they may cross-pollinate with any other runner beans within a few hundred yards.

[veggiechicken]

Runner beans are notoriously promiscuous The French beans should be OK,

[Alison]

What VC said. Blow ever although the runners probably won't come true they will almost certainly still be tasty, although they cross a lot, they're not like squashes which often seem to revert to something that doesn't taste good.

[Alison]

Oh and the runners and Frenchies won't cross with each other as they're a different type

[Bigmallly]

Blow ever although the runners probably won't come true

Can you swallow the Vodka before speaking Alison.....................

[veggiechicken]

I grew Firestorm in the tunnel this year - because its supposed to be self pollinating. Think its some sort of crossed RB/FB.. I've saved some beans so it will be interesting to see what they produce next year.

[Alison]

Can you swallow the Vodka before speaking Alison.....................

Bloomin' predictive text, should have said however although not as bad as a friend of mine who texted her daughter to get the "porn out the freezer" rather than pork yesterday!

[nellie-m]

RB/FB crosses can occur. I have never seen it but from what I've read they are quite interesting because you can see it has happened in the seeds directly, from the original plant! This is very unusual, normally the seeds of the mother plant always look the same, whether crossed or not, and you can only tell it's a cross when you see the actual "child" plant.
In RB/FB crosses however, being from different species, the seed looks different immediately, because the cotyledones that are part of the embryo are larger.

[Penellype]

Whether your closed pollinators will breed true or not will depend on whether or not they are F1 hybrids. If they are not F1 then you should get a crop that is similar to the parent, but if they are F1 you will end up with a mixture of plants, some of which will resemble one grandparent, some the other and some will be like the parent plant.

This is because although the offspring have only one parent, the seeds are formed from pollination, not "parthenogenisis". They still require male and female flower parts even if they are from the same plant.

[skeggijon]

they're not like squashes which often seem to revert to something that doesn't taste good.

Every squash I've ever tasted must've reverted then

[Two_Sheds]

when I ... sow next year will the beans come true or will I get some sort of weird ... hybrid?

As someone who grows 100s of French bean & runner plants every year: most of them come true (99%) but occasionally I get a 'rogue' colour in there, eg. this summer some of my white runner seeds turned into red flowered/purple seeded runners

I pulled the whole plant up & composted it, because I only want white seeded runners.

When I get rogue Frenchies, I have replanted them only to get them turn back into what they should've been in the first place eg. I got some Tiger Eyes that were black with beige stripes, instead of beige with black stripes ~ but the next year they all came out beige again

[nellie-m]

my impression is that sometimes the markings sort of take over, almost covering the surface of the seed so that it appears to be marked just the other way round. This can be one single seed in an otherwise "normal" pod, but also a whole pod on the same plant that has "correctly" marked seeds in all other pods.

I've seen this with very many (if not all) varieties that have seeds with markings. Here is an example of a borlotti dwarf french bean: all pods on the same plant. So far I have been too lazy to experiment but I wouldn't be too surprised if the ones with almost 100% markings would revert to normal markings the following year.

[Chippy Minton]

Thanks all, I love runner beans but, due to many years of knowing people who've had allotments, only in limited quantities So each year I grow a row of climbing frenchies and save the last post for a few runners, just enough I find. I don't really need a whole pack of seeds and thought it might be OK to save the couple of seeds from the "missed" pods.

From what I've read they shouldn't cross, if they do it'll be an experiment but runners may cross with others (doubt there's another runner bean within half a mile ), not that I'd notice as I lost the packet and they were just a couple of runner seeds from the bottom of the seed tin so I have no idea what variety they may have been So I'll give it a go and if all else fails just go and buy a new packet!