Triploid apple rootstock

[FB.]

What do you think about hybrids of M111 and triploid Jonagold?

It should be a strong combination but MM111 seems to have a higher chance of incompatibility with scions than M25.

[digiz]

Thx!
I remember your drawings and photos from old forum.

What do you think about hybrids of M111 and triploid Jonagold?

[FB.]

I am experimenting with triploid rootstocks from seeds. I use seeds from triploid Jonagold apple. When seeds germinate, some have three cotyledones. This is first year, and they are growing fast.
I need vigorous rootstck because land is basically dolomite-limestone gravel with 20 cm black humus topsoil. It gets very dry through summer. Summer in mountains is short.

Does any have experience with this kind of rootstock, some grafting incompatibilities? Drought problems?

I have 15cm of very gritty/chalky topsoil sitting on a 30cm layer of sand, then a metre of gravel over chalk. The soil never floods because the drainage is so good, but it means the soil dries very quickly and can be completely dry to a depth over a metre for weeks at a time in summer.
I live in the one of the driest parts of the UK and only get about 50cm of rainfall each year. It is also one of the warmer and sunnier parts of the UK, with my nearest city (Cambridge) holding the UK's highest temperature record.
Our garden has mostly Mediterranean and other non-native plants because typical British plants can't withstand the very dry summers.

My solution has been to grow mostly triploid varieties on MM111 and M25. They often don't grow for a year or two after planting, with MM111 sometimes taking two or three years to establish before growing well. Also MM111 seems to have incompatibility issues with a lot of scions but is a great rootstock with a compatible scion.
The trees only reach about 2.5-3m in 10 years. Most other rootstocks eventually wither and die, or suffer a lot of disease and produce tiny fruit of poor quality.
I spent some years trying to produce a rootstock capable of producing large trees on very difficult soils and I have a few promising ones. Also B.118 rootstock seems to be tolerant of poor conditions like MM111 and M25.

Of the trees I planted, the most successful have been:
Ashmead's Kernel
Belle de Boskoop
Blenheim Orange
Bramley
D'arcy Spice
Devonshire Quarrenden
Edward VII
Gascoyne's Scarlet
Gravenstein
Hambledon Deux Ans
Irish Peach
Jupiter
Laxton's Epicure
Laxton's Superb
Tydeman's Late Orange

[nickdub]

I guess you also try air layering the varieties you want (assuming you have access to a tree) and then growing them on their own roots.

Growing from cuttings would be another similar option.

[Dave8abond]

I guess you also try air layering the varieties you want (assuming you have access to a tree) and then growing them on their own roots.

[Nicos]

Belle de Boscoop is also pretty big.
I’ve only just noticed it’s a triploid.
Mine is a cross variety apparently. I’ve certainly seen bigger Bramley’s.

https://www.orangepippintrees.com/ar...pple-varieties

[Dave8abond]

Bramley is certainly a biggie and would be pretty easy to get hold of.

One of the largest apple trees I've seen was a Warners King.

[digiz]

Anyone have experience what is most vigorous triploid variety of apples? So i can collect seeds and sowing them.

http://randd.defra.gov.uk/Default.as...rojectID=15150

[Nicos]

Yes you are close :-).

In settings i can only change password and i don't see your signature.

try this…..

Top right of page
click on your name
then click on user settings
click on ‘account’

then amend your account …



hope that helps!

You may need to make a few more posts though before you can access that?

[nickdub]

Obviously, apples grown from pips will give a wide range of variation.

I have no direct experience, but of the old trees I've seen locally in the fields, by far the biggest apple trees were those grown for cider making. Easily reaching 20 m plus high after 50 years.

[digiz]

Yes you are close :-). Geologically this is part of southern Alps-Julian Alps.

In settings i can only change password and i don't see your signature.

[Nicos]

Dolomite - limestone you say…I’m presuming you are in the Balkan’s? ( if so, you might find it helpful to others if you add your location in your signature - as I have done for mine)

Sorry, but I don’t know much at all about rootstock so can’t be of any help tbh.

[digiz]

In this conditions M111 grows like bonsai. Ungrafted whips reached from 1m to 1.8m in five years. Interestingly, scions grafted on M111 rootstocks grows more rapidly, up to 2,5 m.
M111 is basically dwarfing rootstock, compared to seedling.
I am searching for most vigorous rootstock, because i don't want improve soil.
According to literature, triploid varieties have much stronger growth.

Maybe someone have experience with triploid rootstock, or triploid varieties on its own roots in harsh conditions?

[ameno]

I'm not an expert on rootstocks, but what's wrong with the standard vigorous apple rootstocks, like M111 M25? These are supposed to be suitable for poor soils

[digiz]

I am experimenting with triploid rootstocks from seeds. I use seeds from triploid Jonagold apple. When seeds germinate, some have three cotyledones. This is first year, and they are growing fast.
I need vigorous rootstck because land is basically dolomite-limestone gravel with 20 cm black humus topsoil. It gets very dry through summer. Summer in mountains is short.

Does any have experience with this kind of rootstock, some grafting incompatibilities? Drought problems?