greenhouses on allotments?

[paula.berriman]

So, if a greenhouse/shed becomes derelict what happens then?
We dont have a council to put it right.
If a plot has trashed greenhouse on it and a wrecked shed full of junk, how would you feel if this was shown to you as your new plot? I'm just trying to work out if I am being silly by trying to insure that people are able to be given a plot in reasonable condition and not full of the last persons rubbish. Should I adopt the attitude of 'well there it is, take it or leave it' - somehow this seems a bad thing for me to do. I cant give the perfect seed bed but I try to do the best I can for our new plot holders.

In my opinion waiting lists are so long now everyone wants a plot of land and when i got mine i didnt care that it was a mess it was i just pleased that i had one.

I think prevention is the best way forward with this one in ensuring that you chase tennants who are not keeping their plots tidy and serve them notice to clear up or clear out. That way you have a small amount of control over how messy you are prepared to let things get before you take action.

[Headfry]

Oh dear I am struggling with this.......

Thing is we have just has someone give up their plot, they have left it a complete mess and very dangerous - lots of broken glass, old tools and heaps of general rubbish etc.
they are not responding to my messages and phone calls. They may have just moved away. I am not sure if I should be upset or angry. We are a small group of people who look after the site and none of us have the means to clear this plot of all the rubbish.
I am trying to find a way to make it more fair for the people who take on the plot and for us! Think I am sad as I really did not expect this of the ex holder. We really don't ask much of our holders.

[Nicos]

Council site- �10 deposit and key provided.
Never got it returned when we left as they never replied to our letters!!
( gave up in the end)
No greenhouses.


Private site- no deposit but we had to pay for our own keys
Greenhouses and sheds allowed

Why not offer a year- or two- free rent in lieu of clearing it?...you never know- someone may be happy with that offer.

[SarzWix]

Our new rules/constitution has a clause about 'not allowing rubbish to accumulate' or this is reason for an eviction. It might be a good idea to add that to the rules, and put it on the checklist for inspections (which I assume you do monthly?).

As for deposits, I think it's a good idea. But how much to set it at as another matter.

Perhaps you need to raise the rent so that the committee has a fund available to do things like that? In the rent survey done on this board (last year?) your rent would seem to be extremely low compared to other sites? Ours is �32.00 per plot now, but they still don't clear the plots before anyone takes them over...

[Alison]

Monthly inspections - does that happen anywhere? Ours are inspected once a year (April / May ish I seem to remember) but nothing happened to the two derrelict sites last year so am not holding my breath for this year. One of them isn't too bad as there are a number of fruit bushes on it and the holder's sister who also has a plot does cut it back occasionally but the other one is a mess. The holder has dumped a couple of sofas at the back end (the only time he visited last year as far as I know....) and laid a load of concrete paths in years gone by before letting it go to rack and ruin. Apparently he's been inside recently but he didn't do anything before that, but I digress.....

I had no expectations on how my plot should be when I took it on, I liked the fact it was a blank canvas and am proud that I have shaped it with hard work. To be honest I wouldn't have wanted a working party on it as I would have found this pressuring to get it all sorted quickly rather than at my own pace. Basically we all want different things, if it's a total mess and worse than any others then I like the idea of rent for free for the first year.

[HeyWayne]

I'm not going to be predictable and say what we're not allowed to do.

However, our 'expert gardener' has a polytunnel which I would consdier as 'permanent'.

[Paulottie]

Oh dear...lost count of the hours I have spent removing old carpet, chicken wire glass....never thought of a deposit. We do gain a few tools that were left behind though!

I now Mypex any unused land to stop seeding, strimming prob and give incomers a fighting chance.

I got my green house out the hedge...mainly smashed...luckily the glass for the sides was in a pile before the previous manager had hit it with his tractor....he built the base and then did nothing more about it for years....took me a long time to sort it but its a great house.

We have no sheds...You need permission for structures and greenhouses (from me!) There are only four. There are about 18 tenants. They are at the top of the allotments a long way from the road. Two are adjacent to plots (one mine and the neighbouring plots)...the other two are a few plots away from their tennants. A couple of other tenants have neighbouring properties so theirs are on their land.

You probably wouldn't get permission for anything for a couple of years.

[basketcase]

We're allowed sheds and greenhouses, but limited to 6x8 and no higher than 7ft. But that's about average anyway.

Apparently the council won't allow polytunnels (the big ones, not the small 'cloche' ones) "because they look too industrial".

We can't have any livestock of any kind - not even bees.

We don't pay a deposit.

This probably doesn't help you.

[chriscross1966]

We're allowed sheds and greenhouses, but limited to 6x8 and no higher than 7ft. But that's about average anyway.

Apparently the council won't allow polytunnels (the big ones, not the small 'cloche' ones) "because they look too industrial".

We can't have any livestock of any kind - not even bees.

We don't pay a deposit.

This probably doesn't help you.

If it's a statutory site then the council can say what they like, you're allowed chickens and rabbits.... (Section12 IIRC) and there's general provision for keeping pigs and bees too.... From memory it's probably easier to stop you keeping pigs and bees but chickens (not roosters) and rabbits need proper byelaws passing for legitimate reason to prevent them being kept. It's a statutory right and it's very hard to remove them..

chrisc

[organic]

Headfry
I took over a half plot in late summer last year. There were dandelions with roots approaching 2 feet long, bits of wire, broken car lights, bottles, cans, cigarette butts, scafolding poles 3 feet long buried to hold up a big fence for peas and a lot of chunks of brick and the likes.
I genuinely couldn't have cared less about the condition. After a day of stinging my hands on the nettles I got a good pair of those rubber dipped gloves to make it a bit safer and am clearing it.

That said, it wasn't NICE to have to clear that rubbish out.

If you're concerned I'd suggest the best approach is to require plots to be kept tidy and junk-free and for broken glass to be cleared up (personally I don't think it's sensible to say "no glass" and that's speaking as someone who's well within a "stone's throw" of the site fence in an area with its fare share of stone-throwing natives)...

...in the case where there's a derelict shed, greenhouse or a mass of rubbish I think the best approach (if you don't want to say "there's your plot, it's a mess but once you clear it you'll be fine - wear gloves and mind the glass") would be to get the new plot hoder involved.

Tell them the plot is a bit of a mess and needs clearing and they can have it right now and clear it themselves (maybe even give them a month or two rent-free while they get on with it) or that they can get help off some other allotment holders but will have to wait until someone's available and won't get a rent-free period.

The details are yours to decide but if I'd been offered a complete tip of a plot and been given that choice I'd have been more than happy to get on with clearing asap.

It's great that you want to make the transition from "no plot" to "plotholder" as easy and pleasant as possible for newcomers - and I'm sure it'll reduce the number of "more work than I thought" drop-outs - but you might be trying to be too nice.

If they are anything like me, the incoming tennent will be delighted to have the plot and raring to get started - even if it means clearing up after a messy one.

[Paulottie]

I have to agree that I find poly-tunnels Ugly (and noisy on a windy day)...I certainly wouldn't allow one...natives far too snooty here. I appreciate that glass is a problem and toughened expensive.....I think polycarbonate is too and probably just as bad when it shatters....perhaps a time to prove yourself period is the way forward...which is effectively what I run.

We discussed the point about presenting newcomers with a clean plot as making it 'too easy' Organic...that is 'not sorting the wheat from the chaff.' Yes you are always going to get some that give-up/move away anyway and some will probably leave a mess but I think there will be less of them....and the mess will probably be less daunting.

[organic]

I'm inclined to agree... with the time out I had to take the folks at my site got the impression I might be chaff... but I'm hard at work now so hopefully that wrong impression won't last. (I didn't have an address or phone number to get in touch at first and didn't think to when it was just bad weather and frozen ground keeping me away.)

Certainly all this digging is making me feel more determined to look after the plot and try to ensure a good harvest.