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Vermin advice please.

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  • Vermin advice please.

    Only had an allotment for 3 months and have started seeing a few Rats. The question is, should I use poison or Traps?

    Would this be detrimental to other wildlife ie Hedgehogs etc.

    As always advice greatly appreciated.

  • #2
    A recent thread that may help you https://www.growfruitandveg.co.uk/gr...in_100573.html

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    • #3
      Are you allowed to shoot?

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      • #4
        I have used poison. Not the grain type what I get looks more like packets of blu tack. I put it under a large slate supported on a couple of bricks with another on top so that other wildlife can’t get at it. I have used this method in the chicken run with no ill effects. The rats will eat it under the slate or some times they will take it away.

        Bye bye rats!!!!
        Gardening requires a lot of water - most of it in the form of perspiration. Lou Erickson, critic and poet

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        • #5
          Keep disturbing wherever they are and there's a good chance they'll move on. Wildlife cam on my lotty showed a fox the other night with a rat in it's mouth, highlights the downside of using poison.

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          • #6
            if you have a fox you’ve got a good friend, I love mine he keeps the rabbits down for a start, but it is quite natural to have a few animals down on your plot. You might not want them in your home, but your allotment IS his home. We all have to eat.
            I may be hungry but I sure ainít weird

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            • #7
              100% agree with Mr Bones. I had rats In my compost bins and around my shed, now I have not seen any or any evidence of them in weeks, In fact I'm counting it as one of my victories.

              I had good old clear up to remove any cover or harborage for them, they hate being out in the open and prefer to use runs under or behind things, I removed and stopped putting in veg peelings and eggs shells etc onto my compost and routinley made the compost more moist by adding water, whilst also turning them over twice a week - no more rats.

              In my little experience, it just seems common sense to take away what they want which is food, harborage/cover and no disturbance.
              Last edited by Gareth the Duck; 11-01-2020, 07:45 PM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Gordon the gardener View Post
                if you have a fox youíve got a good friend.
                not if you keep chickens. They have broken my heart a few times, they are so crafty a couple of years ago I had to make the decision to not keep any more birds.

                I wouldn't want to poison one though! But on the other hand I would prefer rabbits - even if they do razor off my clematis!
                Last edited by Scarlet; 11-01-2020, 08:49 PM.

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                • #9
                  I am told that the rat poison sold to the public is not as strong as that available to people in the trade and the stuff we can buy is not any good. I shoot if I have to and I will be buying a humane trap to maybe re-locate animals not wanted in the garden. Biggest problem with poison outside is they are indiscriminate, you could kill something like someone's pet.
                  If I'm not on here, I'm probably fishing.

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                  • #10
                    AFAIK its an offence to release a trapped grey squirrel into the wild and maybe the same for a rat.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by veggiechicken View Post
                      AFAIK its an offence to release a trapped grey squirrel into the wild and maybe the same for a rat.
                      Yes - same for rats. Vermin.

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                      • #12
                        Thought so, but didn't want to say for sure as there's always some smartie pants who'd tell me I was wrong.

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                        • #13
                          All methods are complicated.

                          Live traps involve dispatching or release elsewhere(but depends on what wildlife you have caught)
                          You need to check several times a day as the animal (any animal) will not have food or water until you next visit and in the summer potentially become over heated or in winter hypothermic.

                          Snap traps will kill or maim anything which touches it (including breaking children's fingers) and hold them captive and in pain until it is checked.

                          Rats have an amazing sense of smell and memory and tend not to approach any trap they have seen before especially if it has the scent of a human on it.

                          Poison - The thing with rat poison is that rats will often move the food and put it into store without eating it straight away. This then makes it available to any wildlife -even if well hidden and still in situ.
                          A poisoned animal will probably be eaten as carrion by owls or other birds of prey and then they too will die.

                          First line of defence though is to make your plot as rat unfriendly as possible.
                          Last edited by Nicos; 12-01-2020, 09:42 AM.
                          "Nicos, Queen of Gooooogle" and... GYO's own Miss Marple

                          Location....Normandy France

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Scarlet View Post
                            Yes - same for rats. Vermin.
                            Never thought about this for rats, though I knew it was the case for grey squirrels.

                            My friend has just put out a humane trap for a young rat she has in her garden. She plans to relocate it somewhere far away from habitation. She's seen it a few times, including - the rat being chased away by a pigeon. Believe it or not!

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                            • #15
                              Box 1. Law relating to release of captured rodents

                              The legal framework relating to the release of captured rodents includes both (i) animal welfare and (ii) species conservation elements. The latter addresses the potential risks to UK wildlife and biodiversity of releasing species that are not considered to be ‘ordinarily resident’ in the UK.

                              (i) The welfare of captured rodents is covered by the Animal Welfare Act 2006 (Animal Welfare Act 2006 - Explanatory Notes), which puts in place a duty of care for the welfare of all animals under human control (even on a temporary basis). The implications of this to the release or killing of captured rodents is unclear but the capture, release or killing of rodents in circumstances that compromised or might compromise their welfare may be open to challenge if the animals needs are not met as far as is reasonable in the circumstances. If suffering is caused which is deemed to be unnecessary then this will constitute an offence under this Act. Whether the suffering is unnecessary requires the consideration of a number of factors such as whether the suffering could have reasonably been avoided or reduced, whether the control operation was for a legitimate purpose and whether the suffering was proportionate to the purpose of the control operation concerned.

                              (ii) Section 14 of the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 (WCA) (available at Browse Legislation) prohibits the release into the wild any animal which is 1) of a kind that is not ordinarily resident in and is not a regular visitor to GB in a wild state or 2) is included in Part 1 of Schedule 9. Currently (June 2008), the black rat (Rattus rattus), the fat/edible dormouse (Glis glis), the grey squirrel (Sciureus carolinensis) and the Mongolian gerbil (Meriones unguiculatus) are listed on Part 1 of Schedule 9 and therefore cannot be released, except under licence.

                              Under the WCA there is no prohibition on the release of other species of rats or mice which are ordinarily resident in GB. For example, the view of the Department for the Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) is that the release of brown/common rats (Rattus norvegicus) into the wild is not unlawful under the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 because, despite their non-native origins, they could be classed as 'ordinarily resident' in Great Britain as they are now well-established. However, this is not to say that it is acceptable or permissible to release them on other people’s property.

                              Bearing in mind the exceptions above, although the law does not prevent the release of captured target animals (brown rats or mice), it is often likely to be an unwise thing to do either because it is counterproductive to control and/or because it may have adverse welfare consequences for the animal (see text). Release near the point of capture is unlikely to solve the problem as the animals are likely to return unless the premises have been effectively proofed. Release in an unfamiliar environment may have adverse welfare consequences as animals may have trouble finding food and shelter. Also if the area contains suitable habitat it is likely to already be occupied by other members of their species and may not support additional animals.

                              In a nutshell you can release rats as they are indigenous, Grey Squirrels are aliens
                              If I'm not on here, I'm probably fishing.

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