Jimmy Doherty - GM Food Fight

**lynda66** · 26-11-2008, 12:05 PM

you mean he was talking

....... i was too busy drooling

actually i agreed with a lot of the arguments for it ....... i don't really have a problem with it especially if it means they can grow the crops without pesticides ...... which they have no idea what long term damage they do to us either..... and did find it very sad that they can do something to help people in africa, but the powers that be have decided that the people would rather starve ..... than eat 'poison' .... oh yeah i'm sure they would ...... not.

**smallblueplanet** · 26-11-2008, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by lynda66

... and did find it very sad that they can do something to help people in africa, but the powers that be have decided that the people would rather starve ..... than eat 'poison' .... oh yeah i'm sure they would ...... not.

What so you don't think we can help people in Africa without sending them our GM to test out?

**Birdie Wife** · 26-11-2008, 12:18 PM

If the GM seed can be sown and pollinated as usual so that delveloping countries were able to buy the seed and then save it thereafter, that would be a huge benefit. I didn't see the programme, but as I understand it (please someone correct me if I'm wrong), currently any seed the GM plants produce is purposefully enginnered to be kept sterile - this is done to minimise the risk of cross-pollination to non-GM crops. However, it also means that in order to keep prodcuing crops, the developing nations must keep buying seed from the manaufacturers - hardly a sustainable solution. They've got them over a barrel, but for the right reasons, if you see what I mean? It's a catch 22.

**Birdie Wife** · 26-11-2008, 12:19 PM

Originally posted by smallblueplanet View Post

What so you don't think we can help people in Africa without sending them our GM to test out?

I agree

**SlugLobber** · 26-11-2008, 12:21 PM

Yes, i watched it. I did find it quite sad that people went out and destroyed crops like that. Reminded me of when I was at Uni and people went off to 'protest' at various things, 'just because'.

I didn't learn a huge amount, but then I studied Biotechnology as my MSc and even had to endure what can only be described as a publicity lecture by Monsanto! I didn't realise though, just how against GM the Brits are, in comparison to the US and other countries.

What I didn't like, however, was the deforestation that goes on in order to plant the GM soya crops.

**SlugLobber** · 26-11-2008, 12:23 PM

Originally posted by smallblueplanet View Post

What so you don't think we can help people in Africa without sending them our GM to test out?

I think Lynda's point is that the farming people in Africa have not been given a choice. It's not a question of us sending anything. They have their own research stations and scientists, but the governments are often too busy funding other 'hobbies' shall we say.

**smallblueplanet** · 26-11-2008, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by SlugLobber

I think Lynda's point is that the farming people in Africa have not been given a choice...

How true...GM or nothing ay? Why should we send Africa untested seeds? Oh I wonder why! I'm sure there are enough 'traditional' seeds and farming techniques and supplies they could make use of...but good ol' Monsanto (creators of Agent Orange) kindly want to solve all of Africa's problems by supplying them with seed that can only be re-purchased from them - why what an altruistic move that is.

**Alison** · 26-11-2008, 12:29 PM

Whilst I personally don't know a massive amount about this I have a farmer friend who is very knowledgeable and very anti GM. I've seen various articles which show that the enhanced yields aren't enhanced at all and it certainly isn't the simple answer and we should not be relying on it at the expense of other solutions.

**HeyWayne** · 26-11-2008, 12:37 PM

I think lynda's point (and correct me if I'm wrong lynda) was that in the programme they showed footage where the US had shipped tonnes and tonnes (ocean liners full) of grain - it may have been maize, which the Americans have been eating/using for 10 years now, and it was imply turned away because it was "GM".

It was a case of Europe making a decision on behalf of Africa.

They also showed a piece on a country in Africa (I forget the name now, but it may have been Ghana...), where the African people were trying to steal banana plants from a centre where they were growing GM banana plants (resistant against a desease killing all their plantations), and they were trying to steal them because they saw them growing well, while all their own plants were dying around them. Their diet consisted predominantly of this banana - which they had to cook to eat because it wasn't a banana as we know it.

If anyone is against GM, yet like me didn't really know exactly what it meant/involved - I'd say it's worth watching the programme.

**smallblueplanet** · 26-11-2008, 12:45 PM

Originally posted by HeyWayne

... - it may have been maize, which the Americans have been eating/using for 10 years now...

..and that makes it safe how? The yanks aren't exactly reknowned for their views on 'safe' food.

Originally posted by HeyWayne

...and they were trying to steal them because they saw them growing well, while all their own plants were dying around them. Their diet consisted predominantly of this banana - which they had to cook to eat because it wasn't a banana as we know it.

...and that makes GM safe how? I'm sure there are other ways to increase 'banana yield' that doesn't involve GM?

We've seen that Africa is littered with unsustainable examples of technology not solving its problems...what are the long term issues with GM?

**lynda66** · 26-11-2008, 01:19 PM

yes wayne that was my point ........ the african people breaking in to steal the plants shows that actually the people do want to eat, and are willing to take the risk ....... the people aren't given a choice ........ there is mountains of grain there for them to plant, but, they aren't allowed to plant it, so they die of starvation ....... now correct me if i'm wrong ....... but i feel if i was starving, and there was grain there that would grow with very little water, that would keep my children alive for 10 years ........ rather than them dying of starvation next week .......... i know which option i'd go with

i'm not sure if you watched the programme SBP, but if you didn't i suggest you do ...... it was very enlightening ........ i do agree it would be better to not have to do it ........ but i would also rather have food that was naturally resistant to insects, than covered in chemicals to kill every insect in a field ...... even the beneficial ones ...... which in turn affects every level of the food chain.

**HeyWayne** · 26-11-2008, 01:20 PM

Wasn't saying it was safe Manda - equally, we don't exactly know that it's unsafe.

The people in Africa that were starving because their yields were down and they couldn't grow anything else didn't seem to care for "safety" - they simply preferred eating over starvation.

Jimmy's programme (and my sentiment) were not making a judgement on if GM is safe or not - simply that more knowledge/testing is needed before we either accept the use, or dismiss it.

The UK (and EU) is not without its own problems when it comes to technology (food related or otherwise), so I guess Jimmy's point regarding the EU making decisions on behalf of Africa could be seen as somewhat hypocritical.

**smallblueplanet** · 26-11-2008, 01:44 PM

Undoubtedly most people would eat GM food rather than starve - thankfully I'm not in that position.

Is that your point?

Or if as you say more testing is needed (if you accept the neccesity for GM food that is, as opposed to non-GM improvements), where does that leave the starving in Africa?

Far be it from me to suggest that we're being taken on a GM-guilt trip here....feed the Africans GM they want it (rather than starvation)...

**lynda66** · 26-11-2008, 01:50 PM

obviously it's not the only point, but it was a big one for me ....... never really having taken much notice of GM before ........ there is also the chemical sprays issue, we mostly grow our own so we can avoid spraying, yet everything we buy is sprayed 4-5 times a year with chemicals that kill things ....... i'm actually more bothered about the damage that is doing to our insides, and to the planet, than adding a fungicide before the plants grow, or making tomatoes purple so they have more essential nutrients in them ......... and those tomatoes were gorgeous ...... i want some.

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Jimmy Doherty - GM Food Fight

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