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A quickie about clay soil

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  • #1

    A quickie about clay soil

    I've searched and have found some helpful answers, but part of the solution still not clear...

    I'm in the process of double digging some beds and for the most part the top spit has been really nice soil, but under some of it, the second spit is a really heavy clay type soil. Yesterday there was a bit of puddling on top of the spot I was to start digging but I think that was down to it being hard packed from me walking all over it while digging and backfilling the next bed along. A poke with a fork and all the water drained off very quickly.

    I'm using the Square Foot Gardening system so will have all sorts growing above it, but I wonder is it worth trying to improve that bottom spit at all or just throw the good soil back on top and get on with it?

    I've got about 6 bags of leaves from last autumn (probably not rotted down a whole lot yet) which could go in, and I've got access to a massive pile of wood chips (though going by the smell I think they are pine and I'm sure someone on here told me that stuff isn't the best - too acid maybe? - that was in relation to composting though so I don't know if it comes into it with my main beds) and that's about it. I'm on a pretty tight budget so anything that needs buying in would need to be very cheap.

    So - any suggestions?

    Just get on with the growing or do something with this bottom spit before I backfill on top of it?
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  • #2
    It would be a lot of extra work to improve that second spit: and most plant roots won't go down that far?
    I'd just keep on adding good stuff to the surface, and let the worms work it in.
    All gardeners know better than other gardeners." -- Chinese Proverb.

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    • #3
      Could it be worth putting some stuff (some of the part-rotted leaves maybe?) between the two spits rather than working it into the bottom one?

      I don't expect the worms need too much help getting leaves down but might it speed along the clay improvement if I do something like that?

      Are things like woodchips any use for clay or not worth bothering with?

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      • #4
        Originally posted by organic View Post
        Could it be worth putting some stuff (some of the part-rotted leaves maybe?) between the two spits
        I find that buried leaves don't rot, they stay as leaves (same with my newspapers that I'm now digging back up

        have a look-see at this
        All gardeners know better than other gardeners." -- Chinese Proverb.

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        • #5
          If I were you I'd fork over the bottom spit a bit to open it up, then add some good well composted stuff on top followed by the top spit. Even if it is only fbb or chicken pellets.
          Whooops - now what are the dogs getting up to?

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          • #6
            I dug down one spit for all the beds I've made, added my own compost etc as I went [not all at once], the soil is friable and good to work with now,no plants have suffered for me not digging down two spits or improving the second spit down if that makes sense.
            As you've said in another post,you'll end up edging the beds because digging has increased the level of soil. With your compost from next year and the leaves, you'll increase the height again,giving you a greater depth of soil to grow in.
            In short,I wouldn't bother improving it because it'shighly unlikely that you'll ever have something growing that deep unless it's comfrey.

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            • #7
              TS - that link explains things well. I definitely won't be putting non-rotted things in.

              Jeanied - what's fbb? You've got me with that one I'm afraid.

              Taff - it makes perfect sense. Cheers.
              (Thanks for the reminder that I need to get some comfrey growing on the plot too.)

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              • #8
                Sorry Organic - fish blood and bone.
                Whooops - now what are the dogs getting up to?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Two_Sheds View Post
                  I find that buried leaves don't rot, they stay as leaves (same with my newspapers that I'm now digging back up

                  have a look-see at this
                  I've been told that newspapers should be no more that six pages thick or they wont rot.Not sure if its correct or not yet,I will know when I dig up my bean trench

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                  • #10
                    i add shredded newspapers, makes it a bit airy and gives some space for worms (or that's what I like to tell myself)

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                    • #11
                      A layer of leaves between first and second spit will make the top spit MORE waterlogged. You can liken it to putting a layer of polythene in which stops water percolating through as quick. Leaves rot very slowly on the surface, and one spit below ground they will rot slower still!
                      My Majesty made for him a garden anew in order
                      to present to him vegetables and all beautiful flowers.- Offerings of Thutmose III to Amon-Ra (1500 BCE)

                      Diversify & prosper


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                      • #12
                        What I'd do, and I have 100ft by 30ft of thick clay on the lottie; is to get a good bulb planter, and cut 6 bulb planter holes every metre. Fill 3 with home made compost and 3 with sand or gravel. One to add drainage and the other to get some organic down a level. Then let the worms do the rest and mulch as often as you can. If no home made compost, something like scrunched up newspaper or coffee grounds.
                        Last edited by zazen999; 06-04-2010, 09:27 PM.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Snadger View Post
                          Leaves rot very slowly on the surface, and one spit below ground they will rot slower still!
                          When I dug out my 2 year old leaf mulch pile, the top surface was whole leaves, one spades length under that was well rotted leaves.
                          Am I missing something?
                          "Orinoco was a fat lazy Womble"

                          Please ignore everything I say, I make it up as I go along, not only do I generally not believe what I write, I never remember it either.

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                          • #14
                            Jeanied - that makes more sense now. Thanks for the explanation! So is it best to just scatter that over the bottom spit after I've opened it up rather than working it in a bit?

                            Bramble - I don't have that much newspaper to shred - it sounds like it could work though.

                            Snadger - when I was thinking about the leaves thing I did wonder about whether it could make the drainage worse for that read - thanks for confirming it. I'll be sure to remember not to do that!

                            Zazen - I might have to pop along to a coffee shop and see about getting a couple of sackfulls of grounds. I should be passing a few when I pop into town tomorrow so that shouldn't be any bother. Is there any risk of them mucking about with the soil pH or should they be OK that far down? As that should save me needing to buy compost that sounds like an idea I could go with.

                            The one thing I've not checked is how thick the clay layer is. Is it worth making holes for organic matter and sand/gravel if it doesn't go all the way through a clay layer or will it only improve matters even if it goes through to another layer below?

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                            • #15
                              Do you know your current pH?

                              The amount you are going to add will have very little effect; I add loads - my pH is 7.5 so a little more acid is absolutely fine with mine; but the addition of about 3 mug fulls per metre really isn't going to have much effect. Haven't you got any home made compost at all?

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