Penellype's Allotment

[Penellype]

Thanks for writing all that up, Penellype. I've given up on growing climbing beans, but I might try Monte Gusto a go after the excellent write-up you give them. Will also try Lincoln leeks. I use a lot of leeks and to have a summer crop would be fantastic. Sorry you have to give them up. Out of interest, when did you sow and plant them out?

The Lincoln leeks are sold under the name Leek Bulgaarse Reuzen Lincoln (T&M seeds). The important thing to remember is that they are not frost hardy. I usually sow them in a pot indoors in mid March (17th this year) and plant them out in early June. They are ready to eat from early August onwards. They grow taller than winter leeks, often over 2ft, and they are narrower, about an inch in diameter.

[Snoop Puss]

Thanks for writing all that up, Penellype. I've given up on growing climbing beans, but I might try Monte Gusto a go after the excellent write-up you give them. Will also try Lincoln leeks. I use a lot of leeks and to have a summer crop would be fantastic. Sorry you have to give them up. Out of interest, when did you sow and plant them out?

[Penellype]

I had to start another post for these as there is too much for one! No idea what is going on with the fonts either - I am writing these posts in a text document then copying and pasting as it is easier to edit that way, but something very odd is happening to the font and text size.

Carrots (Eskimo, Nandor, Nantes 2, Sweet Candle) I grow 8 buckets of carrots in a dedicated net carrot cage at home and they always do well. In addition I grow a bucket of Nandor with less protection as it is carrot fly resistant. I may try this in the tunnel at the allotment, giving me space for an extra bucket of cauliflower or calabrese at home.

Peppers (Snackbite) – this year I had dreadful trouble germinating peppers and ended up with only 4 plants (from about 15 seeds) when I wanted 6. In desperation I sowed 6 seeds saved from a pepper that had matured over winter, even though this variety is F1. I had no idea what to expect. All 6 seeds germinated and grew well and they have produced peppers which are indistinguishable from the F1 variety as far as I can tell. I planted 2 of them in the growhouse at the allotment but they absolutely hated it. I usually grow them at home on my windowsills where they do ok in 2 litre pots, but I also grow some in a chiligrow planter in my friend's greenhouse where they do really well. I may experiment with some in my greenhouse at home next year.

Nice to have:

Dwarf beans (Sonesta) – I grew these at home this year and they were nice as very early beans, but once Monte Gusto started producing, these got completely ignored. They are temperamental to germinate – are they worth the bother?

Broccoli (PSB Rioja) – this grows well in the tunnel but has been banned from there. It is very big and I am struggling to find space for it as it is too big to grow in a bucket at home. Last year I ate none at all due to grey cabbage aphid. I am hoping for better this time round, but it is too early to tell.

Calabrese – more problems with grey cabbage aphid. These do grow in the 30 litre buckets and I have room for 2 plants in my carrot cage. Normally I would grow another 3 at the allotment, but I am starting to think that until I can sort out the aphid problem that is a complete waste of space.

Florence fennel (Dragon) – These did very well planted among brassicas in the raised beds this year, and fairly well in the tunnel later. I am happy to do both again this time.

Kale (Red Russian) – not my favourite vegetable, but I usually grow some for a change in the winter. Last year it got aphids and whitefly in the tunnel and all I ate was the flowering shoots as a substitute for the aphid-infested PSB. This year's crop has already been thrown out as the leaves were rapidly disappearing under a thick carpet of aphids. They were initially damaged by slugs and the aphids probably took advantage of the weakened plants. I needed fresh seeds and couldn't find Red Russian so I have ordered a similar variety KX-1 to try this time, if I can find anywhere to put it.

Kohlrabi – these are a quick-growing catch crop, easy to start in modules and no problem to house around other young plants that will eventually grow big, eg courgettes or romanesco.

Leek (summer Lincoln) – while it is nice to have leeks in the summer, these are an optional extra which looks like having to miss out this year due to lack of suitable places to grow leeks.

Parsnip (Hollow Crown) – every year I grow a row or 2 of parsnips and sow far too many because I know the seeds don't keep. Every year I eat a couple, make some soup and give some to my brother, and the rest end up being fed to my horse. I will either grow them in the tunnel this year, or not at all.

Runner Bean (Moonlight) – very much 2^nd best to the climbing french beans, and Moonlight is my 2^nd choice as I can't get my favourite Stardust any more. I will probably grow some but they may have to share a teepee with Monte Gusto, depending on whether I can fit 3 teepees in a raised bed or not.

Turnip (Oasis) – like kohlrabi these are easy to start in modules and providing they are well netted against cabbage root fly they do well in small spaces.

Salad leaves are grown at home wherever there is room to put them, for easy picking when I need them.


Now I need to start assigning crops to spaces, leaving some room for flexibility but ending up with a basic plan that I am happy with.

[Penellype]

Someone once said to me "if you do what you always do you will get what you always get", so if I don't like what I always get, the solution may be to change what I always do.

The best way to decide what to do differently is to look at what worked this year and what didn't, and try to work out why, starting with the essentials.

Beans - climbing (Monte Gusto). These were a brilliant success, providing me with a decent serving of beans every day from mid July to October with plenty left over for drying. I am very happy to repeat what I did last year (2 sowings, in early May and late June) and the only question is where to put the teepees.

Beetroot (Boldor) - last year was the first time I have not put these in the hotbed (I used their space for onions) and from the beetroot point of view it was a disaster. Instead of a direct sowing I used modules and transplanted them into the tunnel. This should work - I have seen multiple videos from respected people demonstrating growing beetroot in modules. However from 3 separate sowings I have yet to have a beetroot much bigger than a golf ball. This is not due to the variety - I have had huge roots from Boldor before. Beetroot is one of the crops that will have to go in the tunnel and a direct sowing is not going to work in there because of the slug problem. I am therefore inclined to try the modules again, but this time also sow some in the hotbed for insurance.

Cauliflower (Maybach) - I love cauliflower and find it impossible to grow myself (seedlings keel over and die at the 4 leaf stage regardless of what I do to them). This is the only vegetable plant I buy in and the only supplier of this variety I can find is Marshalls. They sell plants in packs of 16, which is really too many for me, but its 16 or none, so I buy 16. I can fit 8 cauliflowers in a raised bed and most of them do nicely at first then start to suffer from slug damage when they get bigger. Plants grown at home get less slug damage, but cauliflowers are big plants so I can only really accommodate 2 at home. They are brassicas so they can't go in the tunnel next year and they need netting, which is the biggest difficulty at home. I therefore need to allocate most of 2 raised beds to cauliflowers for the first half of the season. The plants have already been ordered.

Courgette (Defender, Sure Thing) - this year I grew Defender in the compost bin and it was a spectacular success – I intend to do that again. I could easily have managed without Sure Thing, which was just as well, because the 2 plants I grew in the tunnel didn't perform well at all. Many of the fruit were damaged by slugs and the plants were too big for me to reach some of the fruit near the side of the tunnel. There is nothing wrong with the variety (it did well in a raised bed last year), but the tunnel is not the right place for it, which is a pity. It will therefore need to be planted as a follow on crop after cauliflowers or winter crops, unless I can fill a 2^nd compost bin full enough to grow it in there.

Cucumber (Mini Munch, Mini Sprint) - I have tried various locations for cucumbers, including my garden, growhouse, greenhouse, raised beds and tunnel, and they consistently perform best in the tunnel. This year one of the 2 plants in the tunnel collapsed and died soon after being planted out. I think this might have been due to vine weevils as there was suspicious vine weevil-like damage on the pea leaves, so the tunnel has been treated with nematodes. This year, rather than planting the cucumbers in the middle of the centre bed, I put them at the ends and trained the surviving one along the pea mesh when the peas had finished. This worked well, although the plant was extremely slow to produce any fruit (probably due to the weather). I am happy to repeat this.

Leek (Oarsman, Giant Winter) - these are giving me a massive headache this year. Normally I plant half of one of the tunnel side beds with leeks, usually about 40 - 50 leeks in all. I do not have room for all these at home. I can't grow them in the tunnel next year because of the leek moth, and I can't grow them in the raised beds because of the white rot. I could make a 3rd hotbed (a lot of work) in which to grow leeks, as this worked with the onions regarding the white rot. The difficulty is that any bed that I plan to plant leeks in is likely to be occupied in spring and I am usually desperate to plant the leeks before the space is ready. There will not be time to make a new hotbed and let it cool for a couple of weeks before planting leeks. Probably the best option is to grow some in the bed between the tunnel and the road, and some at home, although I will probably need to grow fewer leeks overall.

Lettuce (various) - These do well in the hotbed in the spring and I see no need to change that. Later on there are problems with slugs and aphids (as there are at home). This year I found the red leaved Salad Bowl survived in the tunnel, and I will grow some more in there, but the green leaved winter lettuce Brighton disappeared very quickly. These seem better at home where I can keep an eye on them.

Melon (Magenta, Emir) - usually I grow 2 melon plants which take up 2 raised beds, and this seems extravagant as most of the soil is unplanted. This year I put one (Magenta) in half a hotbed alongside onions, and this worked well. I attempted to grow the other (Alvaro, as I couldn't get Emir) up a tripod between the bean teepees as I hadn't anywhere else to put it. This was a complete failure, although I have had success with Alvaro before. I think attempts to grow melons vertically outside are a mistake - they are too vulnerable to cold and wind. I may put the 2nd melon in the growhouse - this has worked reasonably well before, although the sides make it hard to reach the fruit to tie it up. I have ordered some Emir seeds as I find this variety more productive than any other I have tried.

Onion (Sturon) - these were a success in the hotbed and I see no need to do anything different this year. They can share it with spinach and lettuce followed by one of the melons. The only thing I could improve on is covering them with insect mesh once they start to ripen, as this year some of them had holes in which could have been either onion fly or leek moth.

Pea (Meteor, Hurst Greenshaft, Terrain) - these will have to go in the middle of the tunnel - previous attempts at growing them outside have resulted in plants being attacked by sparrows or pigeons and pods infested with pea moth. Netting them makes harvesting very difficult as the peas attach themselves to the net. I have fewer problems at home, although they do sometimes get pea moth, but I don't have room for all of them at home.

Potato (Lady Christl, Desiree) - years of experimenting with beds, bags, buckets, moving things about and different varieties have seen me settle on the current system which is 8 buckets of each of these 2, 4 at home and 4 at the allotment, plus a quadgrow of each at home. 8 buckets fits nicely in an allotment raised bed and is easily covered if the weather is cold. My north facing raised beds at home seem to work fine but the crop is always bigger at the allotment. 2 things I have learned that noticeably increase yields are to bury the bottoms of the buckets an inch or so under the soil then never move them after planting, and to mulch the tops of the buckets (I use strulch but any mulch will do) - both of these help a lot with water requirements. Potatoes need to go in a west bed because the foliage would make mowing the grass path difficult on the east side.

Romanesco- these are my answer to being unable to grow autumn cauliflower, and when they work they are superb. Last year I sowed them too late and they got cold and wet and the heads went brown before they had developed. This year, sown earlier, they have done very well in the raised beds and I currently have more than I can eat (which doesn't matter as you can cut the spears and leave the rest to grow). I am happy to dedicate at least 1 raised bed to romanesco, following on from spring cauliflowers, and I am prepared to ditch calabrese if necessary to do this.

Spinach (Amazon) - my staple spring vegetable, filling the gap between the carrots and the peas. Grows brilliantly in the hotbed in spring and is the main reason why I make a hotbed in January. Attempts to grow later spinach often fall victim to slugs and/or bolting and trying to grow it in modules usually ends in failure. I will keep trying by putting it in any empty spaces I can find until I find a method that works.

Tomato (Oh Happy Day, Sungold) - This year I have grown these 2 at the allotment plus Crimson Crush (I have old seed that may or may not be viable next year) and Garden Pearl. The Oh Happy Day and Crimson Crush always do well either in the soil or a hotbed, and I just need to find a better way of supporting the huge plants and heavy trusses of fruit. I will probably try some sort of A frame next year, if I can find a way to construct one that is strong enough. The Sungold and particularly the Garden Pearl got blight - this was probably my fault for planting the Garden Pearl in the corners of the raised bed, where it all but disappeared under the huge Oh Happy Day. It would be better planted alongside a melon, I think. It isn't a variety I am desperately fond of, although it does make a nice soup. Sungold is another matter, as it is one of my favourites, as is the difficult but gorgeous Ferline. Sungold tends to split, and I am going to try a different variety, Honeycomb as well for comparison. Which of these I grow at the allotment and which I grow at home is yet to be decided.

[Penellype]

Thanks Jungle Jane - I do sometimes plant marigolds in amongst the brassicas, but they always get completely destroyed by slugs. I gave up last year, and interestingly the last 2 years have been the ones where I have had an aphid problem (the whitefly don't seem to mind the marigolds). I think this year I will get some seed and grow a lot more than the dozen I used to buy, as I now have a greenhouse to put them in. It will be interesting to see if they make any difference. I have also heard that aphids don't like the smell of garlic, so I intend to use that as well.

[Jungle Jane]

Flowers might help against pests in the tunnel,I sow about fifty French marigolds,have them dotted about,they’re trap crops too because slugs do eat them but they mostly eat that instead of my fruit & veg,if you have them amongst the brassica in the tunnel it should stop whitefly nesting,they’re repelled by the scent (I also sit a three inch pot of marigold on the potato containers in March/April when young,to keep leaf hopper insects away) great to have everywhere,the scent working in our favour to bring in the predators & repel the pests.

[Penellype]

Growing conditions
These include considerations of sun/shade, water retention, tree roots and known pests. This is where the advice to rotate crops goes out of the window, and things start to get difficult.

Raised beds
The plot slopes slightly down from the road and is open to the east side. The fence to the south plus a few trees and houses cause shade in the winter months but this is not usually a problem. The raised bed area has onion white rot and I therefore can't grow onions or leeks in any of them, although I have managed to grow onions in a hotbed this year.
Bed W1 (West 1) is usually a hotbed. It gets the most early sun so this seems a logical choice, but I have to find somewhere to put the beans next year and I don't want to move them to the south of the plot because of the shading issue, so I may have to move the hotbed to bed W2.
Bed E1 (East 1) has also been used as a hotbed, but the previous owner of the plot next door planted a cherry tree and this tends to shade this bed once the leaves start to open in the spring. I am considering moving the 2nd hotbed to bed E2 to try to avoid this, and use E1 for cauliflowers (most of the raised beds have recently grown brassicas, this one hasn't).
Bed W2 is currently growing romanesco, and does not seem to have a pest problem. However it has grown brassicas for several years and is likely to become a hotbed next year.
Bed E2 has been growing a tomato and attempting to grow peppers in the growhouse. Neither did very well, and this is the 2nd year in a row for tomatoes in this bed, so turning it into a hotbed would not be a bad idea. The growhouse could either go back on the hotbed or be moved to another bed.
Bed W3 usually houses 8 buckets of potatoes. They go well here and because I can change the compost each year, I will probably grow the potatoes here next year.
Bed E3 is currently growing calabrese and some winter spinach. This bed can get very wet especially at the east end (the path next to it floods) and can stay that way all winter. There has been some issues with slugs and grey cabbage aphid.
Bed W4 is the shadiest of the raised beds and has often been used as a "miscellaneous" bed. This year I grew romanesco and kale here and I have had to throw out one of the romanesco plants and all of the kale after they became encrusted with grey cabbage aphid. There are also issues with slugs in this bed. I dare not grow brassicas in it next year.
Bed E4 can also get very wet, being the other side of the path that floods. This bed currently contains parsnips and PSB and as such will not be available until late spring.

Current bean bed
This bed contains 2 bean teepees which are now making it difficult to access the raspberries, so they need to be moved. This leaves a bed which is not quite wide enough to put one of the standard raised beds on it (the width of this bed was originally determined by the size of the existing rhubarb, which has now been reduced from 3 huge plants to 1). I never intended to grow raspberries at this end of the allotment, but they are my favourite fruit, and the ones I originally planted really do not like being flooded when it rains hard. When I planted them there was a leylandii hedge which sucked up a lot of the water - that has now gone, hence the problem. This bed might be big enough to put the growhouse on it, but I may well find when I try it that I struggle to get at the raspberries - I think this is likely. I could well use this sunny bed for tomatoes (which I have done before) - providing I don't shade it with the runner beans in bed W1...

Small bed outside the tunnel
This is a shady bed which is also quite near to the roadside hedge. Being blackthorn, that sends out roots and suckers which easily reach this bed (and others). This year I am growing PSB here, but it is rapidly outgrowing its net cover. Slugs and snails can be a problem here.

Tunnel
A large walk-in area covered in debris netting. Somewhat shaded by the west hedge in the afternoon except in high summer and there are quite a few tree roots from the hedge. Because of the insect protection I have used this for brassicas and leeks, rotating them between beds but always in the tunnel until this year, when I kicked out the brassicas because of infestations of whitefly and grey cabbage aphid. The leeks are going to have to go too, because the tunnel is also infested with leek moth, which is getting steadily worse. This gives me a slight problem - finding enough veg that isn't a brassica and isn't too tall for the side beds of the tunnel. Soft leafy veg like lettuce and spinach disappear over night due to slugs and snails, even when transplanted quite big. Surprisingly strawberries do seem to get pollinated - the tunnel is not insect proof but does keep out the butterflies, pigeons and cats that can otherwise be a nuisance.

West bed - currently leeks (shredded by leek moth) and beetroot, also grew lettuces in the summer, mainly for seed.
East bed - currently strawberries and 2 large courgette plants. I also attempted to grow spinach and lettuce in this bed but they only lasted about a day before disappearing due to slugs.
Centre bed - this has pea mesh down the middle and has grown peas for the last 3 years. There is pea moth at the allotment but it hasn't yet found its way into the tunnel. Peas are too tall for the curved sides of the tunnel so they can't be grown in the east or west beds. I will probably grow peas here again next year. In the meantime I have planted some late beetroot where the peas were, and I also grow cucumbers in bottomless pots in here. The idea this year was one plant at either end of the bed, but the one at the shed end died. I replaced it with a teepee of late french beans which has worked well.
End bed - Quite shady and damp. This grew PSB for 4 years until this year, as the tunnel is higher here. This year I grew late peas in this bed, but they didn't do very well (too shady?).
Bed near door - another bed that tends to be invaded by blackthorn suckers from the roadside hedge. This has grown strawberries in the past and I attempted kale last year which didn't do well. This year a stuck a spare tomato plant (Oh Happy Day) here and to my surprise it has done ok.

Compost bin
This year I experimented with growing a courgette (Defender) in one of the compost bins and it was spectacularly successful. If I can find enough compost to fill the bin to the top again I will definitely do the same next year.

To be continued...

[Penellype]

What do I want to grow? In addition to the perennials already growing, this is the order of preference:

Essentials
Beans - climbing (Monte Gusto)
Beetroot (Boldor)
Cauliflower (Maybach)
Courgette (Defender, Sure Thing)
Cucumber (Mini Munch, Mini Sprint)
Leek (Oarsman, Giant Winter)
Lettuce (various)
Melon (Magenta, Emir)
Onion (Sturon)
Pea (Meteor, Hurst Greenshaft, Terrain)
Potato (Lady Christl, Desiree)
Romanesco
Spinach (Amazon)
Tomato (Oh Happy Day, Sungold)
(at home - carrots, tomato Shirley indoors, peppers indoors, microgreens indoors, salad leaves, herbs, apple James Grieve, more blueberries and strawberries, framberries, white currant) Some of the essentials, such as peas and potatoes are grown both at home and at the allotment.

Nice to have
Dwarf beans (Sonesta)
Broccoli (PSB Rioja)
Calabrese
Florence fennel (Dragon)
Kale (Red Russian)
Kohlrabi
Leek (summer Lincoln)
Parsnip (Hollow Crown)
Runner Bean (Moonlight)
Turnip (Oasis)
(at home - salad leaves, eg mizuna, pak choi, corn salad, apricot if it will fruit!)

Possible additions for 2024
I have tried once already to grow a pear tree but it died. I wouldn't mind a stepover tree if I can find one - a pear planted in the ground at the allotment would probably grow too big very quickly.
I may try cabbage, but these are usually a disaster.

There are some obvious omissions from this list - I don't like squashes, chard, sweetcorn, chillies, bitter leaves such as endive or radicchio, radishes or artichokes, and I see no point in growing them. I recently watched a 1/2 hour video which had tips and tricks for growing veg and I was really interested to see what they were, but the man didn't grow ANYTHING I would happily eat!

So the next step is to start to plan what will go where, but first I need to consider the growing conditions, which are extremely variable even in a fairly small plot...

[Penellype]

Time to start thinking about next year, and as I am finding this difficult this year (for reasons that may become apparent), I thought I would share the process I am using to decide what goes where.

First things first, a plan of the allotment:




I suspect many of you will have drawn out a plan on your computer and have it all neat and tidy. My computer skills don't stretch to that, so I prefer old fashioned paper and pencil/pen. I've made a few mistakes, so it isn't the tidiest of plans, but it is good enough to give an idea of what is where. The scanner always cuts a bit off the paper, so the bit missing at the bottom just says "Fence".

Some of this stuff is moveable, some is not. The tunnel obviously stays where it is, as do the woodshed, shed, water butts and IBC container (next to the shed where it says water). The compost bins stay put as do the cherry, red currant, raspberries, rhubarb, blackcurrant, gooseberry and chilean guava.as these are all planted in the ground. The blueberries are theoretically moveable as they are in pots, but they are staying where they are. The bean teepees will need to be moved now that the new raspberries have grown, as I will need to get to that side of the raspberries to harvest them next year. The growhouse is not difficult to move as the glass can be lifted out and the frame is aluminium so it is quite light. The hotbeds each have 3 layers of wood, the other 6 raised beds have 2, but as the beds are all the same size, sections can be moved to other beds, although this is not the easiest thing to do on my own. Water bins can be moved when empty, although having got the IBC and displaced 3 of them, there are not really many options.

The areas available for planting are therefore:
8 raised beds 3ft x 2m (yes I know the units are different, but the sizes worked out best that way), of which as many as I like can be hotbeds as I have an almost limitless supply of horse muck, the limiting factor being how much I can cart about before I am exhausted.
An area in front of the new raspberries (currently beans), which is almost exactly 2ft x 6ft - the same size as the growhouse.
A small bed outside the tunnel, probably 2ft by 4-5ft.
2 long beds in the tunnel, one of which is partly occupied by strawberries.
A shorter bed down the centre of the tunnel
A very small bed near the tunnel door
A bed at the shed end of the tunnel, probably 2ft by 6ft.

I also have a garden at home with a greenhouse (fairly shady) and room to plant some veg.

Plenty of space! Or is there?

The next thing to do is decide what I want to grow...

[rary]

Thanks, Penellype. I keep pondering a greenhouse/polytunnel. Still no closer to making a decision, mind! Do you have any views on netting rather than plastic or was your choice a matter of convenience?

Snoop you could always try and find someone who sells secondhand micromesh, which gives a little more temperature protection and also use A frames with support ribs as this might shed the snow a bit better, rather than inverted U shaped covers

[Andraste]

Great tip about taking the top net off in case of snow Penellype - I must mention that to OH for our brassica frame (I'm too short to reach lol)

[Snoop Puss]

Absolutely brilliant, Penellype. Really useful. Nothing like the voice of experience. Wind is an issue here, snow too. I had a makeshift mini polytunnel with plastic and we had a huge snowfall one year. It withstood that, but not when the snow started shifting as it started to melt. I should have thought to brush it off first, but we were dealing with other damage and I didn't get to it till it was too late.

Thanks for your comments. I'll bear them in mind.

[Penellype]

The net tunnel was on the allotment when I got it, so the choice was made for me. Netting gives a small amount of frost protection but nowhere near as much as a greenhouse, conversely, it doesn't get stiflingly hot when the sun is strong, which greenhouses and polytunnels do, particularly if they are fairly small. The tunnel does a great job of keeping cats and birds off the crops, but as it is not completely insect proof I do still get insect pests, which can't be picked off by birds, so there are pros and cons in that department. I have grown crops that need pollinating in the tunnel (strawberries and tomatoes) but I would hesitate to try growing something like runner beans, melons or ordinary courgettes (the ones I grow are parthenocarpic, not ordinary ones that need pollinating) in there.

The netting is fastened onto the framework with nylon fishing line and weighed down at the edges with bricks, and I have had no issues with wind, although it does have a hedge on the west side to act as a windbreak. I have seen people have various problems with polytunnels in the wind, including the one on the plot next door to mine being blown onto my plot even though it was weighted down with 4 large slabs of concrete. My friend at the stables has given up with polytunnels completely having had the covers shredded repeatedly by wind, and she now covers her frames with netting. I have also seen issues with greenhouses with polycarbonate windows being damaged by wind. I take the top net off in winter as I doubt the frame would stand up to a heavy fall of snow.

Hope that helps!

[Snoop Puss]

Thanks, Penellype. I keep pondering a greenhouse/polytunnel. Still no closer to making a decision, mind! Do you have any views on netting rather than plastic or was your choice a matter of convenience?

[Penellype]

Really enjoyed looking at your photos, Penellype. I have absolutely no luck growing climbing beans. It looks as if you're growing yours under cover. Is that a netting polytunnel you have?

Yes it is basically very large piping hoops covered with debris netting. The beans are only under cover because that is where I had a space - there was meant to be a cucumber climbing up the tripod, but it died, so I decided to try the beans.

French beans self pollinate (unlike runners) so you don't need to grow them outside. I have sown some more about a fortnight ago to put in the greenhouse as an experiment. I doubt they will do any good, but I wanted to test my saved seed for viability and you never know, they just might produce something if frosts are late this year.