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  • Dog poo woes

    What do I do with soil that was unfortunately used as a dog toilet for loads of months? The plan is vegetables, but don't want to be killing anybody lol. Can do raised beds with a membrane underneath?

    Thanks

  • #2
    What a horrible situation to have to deal with. Could you get a soil analysis done- RHS possibly. It must be possible to decontaminate the ground. Good luck.

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    • #3
      Grow flowers for this year. You get to work the soil but not eat anything.

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      • #4
        I kill flowers.

        Will not an impermeable membrane and raised beds not do? Apparently it takes about a year for the impurities to come out. I've got a digger here now and pull out the majority of the worst contaminated stuff, and the put membrane beds, soil and mulch. Maybe the heat the mulch brings will help move the last of the impurities? I'm desperate to get the beds up this year, greenhouse going up this weekend. I've waited for a long time now lol.

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        • #5
          Got to worry about worm eggs too. They can last some time I think. I remember one of our visiting lecturers - a mushroom specialist- was telling us about an anti-drugs talk he was invited to give at a university. He kept it short and sweet by passing on the stats from the local hospital. Treatments for parasitic worms always went up around term time, when students would go magic mushroom hunting in the local dog-walking park. Ewwwwwwwww!
          The Impulsive Gardener

          www.theimpulsivegardener.com

          Chelsea Uribe Garden Design www.chelseauribe.com

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          • #6
            Worms are actually one of the biggest/most common concerns. Thankfully the dogs in question are regularly wormed.

            Just trying to figure out how to manage this without losing another growing season.

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            • #7
              Just don't grow salad there, surely? I don't see how washed and cooked vegetables, or fruits/other veg where the edible part doesn't touch the soil, could harm a human.

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              • #8
                I wouldn't be using the soil. I'd pull up about 8 inches of the worst soil (the area is non-draining so was pure mud, water and dog dirt) Even it out, then install impermeable membrane and raised beds. Then I'd fill the raised beds. The soil would be contaminate free surely since it's store-bought and separated from the bad soil by membrane? I would surround the beds with bark chip or similar.

                Next year or to play it safe, the year after, I should be able to remove the membrane and raised beds while leaving the soil from the beds and turning it over with the ground soil and fertilisers. Then I should be able to use the ground, and not raised beds.

                I'm not that experienced by any means, but this is what I've managed to cobble together after hours of research. I think I'm looking for confirmation (or not) that this is a feasible way forward (or not) from those much more experienced than me.

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                • #9
                  Just grow in pots this year, use the pots to cover the contaminated area

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ashkat View Post
                    I wouldn't be using the soil. I'd pull up about 8 inches of the worst soil (the area is non-draining so was pure mud, water and dog dirt) Even it out, then install impermeable membrane and raised beds. Then I'd fill the raised beds. The soil would be contaminate free surely since it's store-bought and separated from the bad soil by membrane? I would surround the beds with bark chip or similar.

                    Next year or to play it safe, the year after, I should be able to remove the membrane and raised beds while leaving the soil from the beds and turning it over with the ground soil and fertilisers. Then I should be able to use the ground, and not raised beds.

                    I'm not that experienced by any means, but this is what I've managed to cobble together after hours of research. I think I'm looking for confirmation (or not) that this is a feasible way forward (or not) from those much more experienced than me.
                    But surely, if this area is non-draining, then you will never be able to grow in the ground?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by ashkat View Post
                      the area is non-draining
                      Well, that's no good for anything then. You can, however, erect deep raised beds as you say. Most veg would need at least 12" of topsoil/compost to grow

                      I compost my dog's poop, but I don't use the subsequent compost on veg, just on the flower beds. You might want to have a read of Composting Dog Waste if you haven't come across it already, and the HH is very good on the killing of pathogens.

                      However, you aren't composting it, you're trying to grow on ground that's been a dog loo, and which might be contaminated with zoonotic [transmittable from animals to humans] pathogens.

                      "Domestic dogs have long been recognized to be a potential source of zoonoses. People are exposed to these pathogens through direct or indirect contact with infected dogs or their feces, and they may become infected after inadvertent ingestion"

                      "Zoonotic agents identified include bacteria, protozoa, and helminths known to cause both systemic and gastrointestinal disease in people"

                      source

                      If it was me, I'd either turn that area over to green manure/comfrey beds (depending on how large the area was) or erect the deep raised beds if it's your only growing space
                      Last edited by Two_Sheds; 19-04-2012, 06:37 AM.
                      All gardeners know better than other gardeners." -- Chinese Proverb.

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                      • #12
                        To offer a little perspective: horse manure poses a potential risk to human health too, but we gardeners use it with gay abandon

                        eg, "Campylobacter is the most common bacterial cause of gastroenteritis ...You can also prevent Campylobacter infection by avoiding contact with horses and their manure"
                        Last edited by Two_Sheds; 19-04-2012, 06:57 AM.
                        All gardeners know better than other gardeners." -- Chinese Proverb.

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                        • #13
                          As does fresh chicken manure. Community Cluckers: Reader's Question: Is chicken manure safe to use as a fertilizer?

                          Personally, I'd do as you described. Remove the worst of it, put down a membrane if you want (though I probably wouldn't bother - not sure what it hopes to achieve), use 12" deep raised beds, and avoid eating dirt, i.e. wash and cook your veg, don't grow root crops for a bit, maybe avoid tricky things like leeks that drag dirt up with them. I probably would keep the raised beds if possible, firstly because if the area has poor drainage you'll do better with raised beds, and secondly because if you cover nematode eggs you protect them from dessication, cold, etc., so may assist them in surviving beyond a year.

                          Dogs poo on my allotment. I wash my veg. The risk is greater if it's been a dog toilet, but common sense hygiene and minimising contact with the contaminated area still resolves a lot of it.
                          Proud member of the Nutters Club.
                          Life goal: become Barbara Good.

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                          • #14
                            I agree, don't get all panicky about it.

                            Dogs and other species, esp. birds (bird flu?), foxes (tapeworm, toxacara) poo all over the place where we grow our food and where we eat (park picnics, the beach): most of the time we don't know about it.

                            Wash your food, wash your hands before eating, you'll mostly be fine
                            All gardeners know better than other gardeners." -- Chinese Proverb.

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                            • #15
                              Thankyou

                              The membrane would prevent cross contamination between the soil I bring in and the currently toxic (LOL!) soil that's existing.

                              The area is fairly non draining, but that is likely due to the clay content, I've been wondering if maybe with some work and turning, the soil would be usable.

                              And, if it was only a little pooh, I wouldn't be worried at all. However, my garden was naught but a pond due to the 'drainage'. I have 2 american Akitas who chose that area of the garden to use as their toilet. Given several factors, the biggest being a husband that was drafted away for 14 months, 4 young children, weather and just the sheer state if the garden, picking up the refuse was just impossible. Was horrible, especially when your garden is your source of peace.

                              After official complaints being filed against housing here, the association agreed that the problems were due to a serious lack of drainage and that it was their responsibility to fix it. My pups are getting their own fenced in area, drainage is being installed and the whole garden redesigned and turfed as we speak.

                              Anyways, the amount of poo was too much for me to mess around with. I wont plant into the ground for probably 2 years or so.

                              Thank you so much for the information. I am so looking forward to getting things back to the way they were. x

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