Petrol Prices

So basically you're saying "BOYCOTT ESSO and BP" until they reduce their prices (and buy your petrol at Tesco instead)

While I agree that in principle, such a boycott could well trigger a price war (if it got enough people behind it, which by no means certain) I doubt it would have as big an effect as one might hope.

On a litre of petrol currently costs between Ł1.10 and Ł1.20
Of that something in the region of 80p is tax. That leaves the actual cost of the petrol somewhere around the 30p to 40p per litre mark. The at-the-pump cost at absolute best would be 90p if the petrol companies sold at 10p per litre. Even if they cut their prices in half petrol would still cost about Ł1 a litre thanks to the VAT and fuel duty.

All the numbers above are approximate, but they paint a very clear picture.
As evil as the oil companies are (if you're into that kind of thing) they are not the main problem in that at-the-pump prices.

The people your gripe lies with are the people in government. Get rid of them (not all, I do think we need a government - but my ideal bares scant resemblance to the current system) and the pump prices would drop by about 55% overnight (and that actually allows for a "because we can" price rise of about 15p by the petrol companies when the tax comes off).

But then the new govt would have to raise revenue somewhere else. Income tax rises?
Or cut public services

Plus if petrol was to become very much cheaper, even more car journeys would be made, resulting in more congestion, more pollution, more damage to roads that can't be repaired because the council can't afford it .... and on and on and on

And in the new utopia with segregated bike facilities, the car users could either continue using the congested, pothole riddled roads or join the rest of us on the cycle lanes (without their cars, of course).

I say let's go laissez-faire with pretty much everything and in the case of roads and cars people will change as soon as they no longer want to put up with the problems their own choices are causing them.

One thing's for sure. Regulation of public transport in Manchester makes it inefficient and expensive in all areas but one. In the student corridor to the south of the city, where bus companies openly compete with eachother, prices are as low as 50p to Ł1 for a single journey with weekly tickets around the Ł3 mark. At one point there were so many busses on that route it wasn't even worth running for a bus. Now they are forced to observe the posted timetables which is a far worse way of doing it, but still better than elsewhere. For the rest of us, 50p won't even buy a concession (pretty sure it went up to abut 80p) and a weekly is over Ł10. Because the regulators don't allow competition on my route - it's cheaper to use a car if you're not a regular city-centre commuter on an annual ticket.

As for tax revenue - the cost of government itself is a large part of the problem - cutting back cost of government from the level in 2007 to the level in 2002 would save enough money to abolish Income Tax, Inheritance Tax, Capital Gains Tax, along with Beer and Wine duty and still leave a surplus for some tax cuts elsewhere. It's not hard to see that trimming a bit more fat still could easilly accomodate fuel duty being cut altogether and that's without even getting close to the kind of thing I'd rather see.

"Public services" - a large part of that simply means "things that could be done by the private sector done inefficiently and expensively by the government".

Here's going from some Labour propaganda that came through the door yesterday.

"In Bury, Ł3218 per Primary school under Labour. Ł1386 per pupil under the Conservatives."
In more accurate words "Under this government, the cost of educating the same number of students in the same number of schools has increased by 232%."

Open that up to competition and things would change. Parents would demand 2 things: quality and affordability. Two things the private sector could achieve and the public sector never does.

Even if laws were passed requiring the private sector to accomodate those who couldn't afford market rates (which would, of course, be means tested) things would be far cheaper and far more efficient than they are when the government "provides" them for free.

Not that the government provides anything, of course, it just takes our money and spends it on things inefficiently... wasting mountains of money in the process.

Most of this has little to do with fuel duty though. :P


How about this...
Let's abolish fuel duty and vehicle excise duty.
Then let's introduce a new scheme of road/vehicle tax. Vehicles will be taxed based upon the weight of the vehicle. That way everyone pays for the upkeep of the roads based upon the damage done (proportional to the weight of the vehicle).
The road repair work will be carried out by private companies who will be contracted to do the work to a satisfactory standard and payment witheld until that standard is met (and if it's not met, payment will not be made).
The roads are maintained, the cost is spread fairly and the standard of the repairs is high.
Stick a wee bit on top of the tax and we'll have the money needed to develop widespread segregated cycle facilities.

So crazy it just might work - and the overall saving in the wider context of a vastly reduced government would be huge.

The big problem is the Goverment have got a war to fund and that is bleeding this country dry and they need the money so no fuel tax what replace's it...jacob

I treat these emails as spam and do not trust them at all, regardless of the content.

Let's replace it with not fighting a war that we started. In fact, I'd like to adopt a general policy of not starting wars.

Like the trains?

What about health care for the elderly? I know a housebound old lady who has carers come in to wash her, feed her and keep her house clean. These carers are from an agency, and some of them frankly couldn't care less. They certainly aren't nurses, they aren't trained properly and they don't form any kind of relationship with the 'patient': indeed, the old lady doesn't know who she's seeing from one week to the next. They turn up late, or not at all. They stand outside having a fag instead of cleaning the house.

I'm not going to get old, I'm going to have a short break in Switzerland instead

Blimey...nine steps from petrol to topping yourself in Switzerland via revolution...must be a record here.

Having worked at Esso, they sell to the supermarkets also, so you will see tesco, sainsburys etc filling at their depots, the only difference is the additives that go in !

Depends which grapes are having the discussion , Paul - and how much vino they have had!

I have all but given up using my car.
I use it now only to get to places that public transport cant/wont take me fairly easily/directly and when I have something heavy such as gardening equipment to carry.
I have filled up about 3 times since November and am shocked by the hike in prices every time I go.

Personally I think the best way to hit the petrol dealers and government via tax is to not buy petrol at all.

I'm going to look into getting a bike soon! I still have to drive for work but then, work is not going to last forever!